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Originally Posted by drgoodtrips
I bolded the part that interests me and is relevant (IMO) to this thread. The rest seems like a partisan rant, which is, at best, tangentially relevant and overly specific to current political attitudes in the US (thus crippling any real impact on the discussion).
It seems to me that you are saying that nation states are often forged out of a desire for specific changes, and with a spirit of strong agreement among the founders as to what principles should provide the basis for that society. It then seems to me that you are arguing that deviance from these goals is what leads to the downfall of said societies. Is this correct?
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It CAN be that deviance from those goals leads to a downfall. More likely it's going to be a combination of that and changes made through time to ADJUST to certain variances introduced (unforeseen/unintended consequences). Internal enemies are an often ignored danger too. Ignored ? Yes, because they aren't veiwed as enemies when they're doing their work.
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Originally Posted by drgoodtrips
Would you say that this is broadly applicable, not just to the US, but also to other nations born in revolution (or colonization) such as Soviet Russia? Did the USSR fall apart because it deviated too heavily from the original ideals?
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I'm not sure the USSR fell apart because it deviated to heavily from it's original intentions. That may be the CASE but I don't know. It may BE that it's original intentions were an unweildy or unworkable way of managing a society/civilization. That seems the most likely. It may ALSO be that it was a combination of these factors.
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Originally Posted by drgoodtrips
So, do you believe that the course of human history is comprised of little "bursts" of greatness (revolutions to form nation states) followed by long periods of slow decline, which set the stage for the next "burst"?
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I DO beleive that that is the relatively RECENT course of human history (last 2 or 3 thousand years). With our very recent grasp on technologies giving us so much power to use, comes much responsibility. Time will tell if we are ready FOR the responsibilities that come with the latest technologies we've acquired. We have an opportunity to possibly "evolve" beyond this pattern in the handling of our social order(s). Time will tell.
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Originally Posted by drgoodtrips
The first two sentences intrigued me because I was curious as to how you would defend your ethics from a logical standpoint, but then you dropped the ball with a blanket ad hominem asserting that people only disagree with your opinions because they've "been fed garbage". You might as well have said "My ethics are logical because if you don't share them you're a poo-poo head.
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I should have maybe said that many of us really aren't interested in anything beyond ourselves and our OWN insular little lives. This makes these kinds of people (what I just described) somewhat vulnerable to manipulation via the media and the economy.
Oh yeah, you ARE a poo poo head
Welcome to the poo poo head club mate :-)
Couldn't resist LOL